Nitrocellulose

[THErAPIST]

using who's method?

[kbk]

I used your method actually...There is no where I can hook up a heat source for distillation so until I can I will do it that way.

[THErAPIST]

ah okie, as long as it works :wink:

[kbk]

I don't know if I let my NC nitrate long enough because it doesn't seem to be working...I am going to try TNP as soon as I get more aprin I was going to try nitrostarch but I've heard it sucks.

[THErAPIST]

nitrostarch does suck. too much work for soemthing ot so great..

Nitrocellulose has to nitrate for atleast 15 minutes. After that, the longer it's there the more sensative it gets. after about 30 minutes it doesn't get any more sensative. If youre doing nitrocellulose, it's common for it to turn a slight yellow color. so if your tissue paper doesnt turn yellow, you screwed up somewhere probably.

Brainfevert has a synth that i used to use. it works pretty well. http://www.geocities.com/brainfevert/index6.html

[kbk]

Must not be dry enough then, I let it nitrate for 30-45 mins and when I light it on fire it doesnt do anything. It's been drying for a long time though. The filter/things I've dried it on (newspaper etc) did turn yellow though.

[THErAPIST]

you didnt wash all of the acid out then i dont think. wash it with more water, then throw a couple tablespoons of baking soda in about 2 cups of water
wash the nitrocellulose with that water, and then wash it again with regular water.

THEN dry it..

[kbk]

I did wash it like that before....But I will do it again.

[THErAPIST]

what kind of sulfuric acid did you get?
what's the concentration?
what's the brand name?
what color is it?
is it thick and goopy, kinda like syrup, or is it really thin and flows really well like acetone?

Those questions DO have a point. answer em as accurately as you can and i'll see if it's a problem with your sulfuric acid (that wouldn't suprise me actually becauise ive fucked up on the right sulfuric to use before too)

[kbk]

I use the same sulfuric acid as teknix does on APC, here's a link with pictures of the one I have, http://freepgs.com/pyroteknix/h2so4.htm . It is the one at the top that says "Good sulfuric acid". It is goopy, like syrup, my nitration process for the NC looks just like the one on that website.

[THErAPIST]

ah.. I really have no clue why your stuff isn't working then... ive never failed with it...

I'll see if i can find my synth procedure for NC later, and i'll post it if i find it. maybe it'll work... it's something like brainfevert's, but i always got better results and increased yields with it

[THErAPIST]

Nope, I don't have my synth info anymore.

Basically it was nearly the same as brainfevert's method except I used a little bit more acid and nitrate (so that my yield was bigger). I also packed toilet paper into it until there was just a little free flowing nitrating liquid around. Then I let it nitrate for 45 mins with the reactant vessel in a plastic bowl of ice and water. It was washed 10 times or so, using a bicarbonate wash atleast 4 times, with a wash of regular water after that to was out any residual bicarbonate. Then I left it scattered out on some news paper to dry for a day or so.

I really couldnt say whats wrong with your synth. Youre the only person ive ever known to have a problem with the synth i liked to..

[kbk]

:( damn...I failed. O well I will try it again soon using brainfeverts method this time.

[Douchermann]

Where'd you get your cellulose from? It might be wet by itself, and coulda screwed up the nitration. Take your cellulose, boil in 2% NaOH water (optional), then test with litmus, if its basic, boil with 1% HCl (optional). Then put it in the oven at 100degrees for a couple hours. Then try to nitrate it.

[THErAPIST]

Eh.. It's pretty common for people to just use some dry facial cotton balls, or some dry toilet paper, or a dry paper towel.

As long as the cellulose is not visually damp it should be ok. If it doesnt work then it's likely either the purity of the sulfuric, the purity of the nitric, or it wasn't allowed to nitrate long enough. If the temp is above 30?C it may not nitrate as well. The same goes for if the temp is 0?C or below.

[Douchermann]

It could be a combination. I don't know whats wrong with my stuff, pretty sure its moisture though. I used to produce some kick ass NC (the kind where if you lit it in your hand, then droped it before the flames got to you, it would burn up everything including the ashes before it hit the ground) My last 2 batches would actually sit on the ground and burn. The only thing i have changed from the last 2 batches is the sulfuric, which has been working fine for all my other explosives (TNP, mekp (it screwed it up) and acetone peroxide) The first one that failed I had used potassium nitrate, which i hate doing for NC because when you let it cool down, it forms this rock hard kno3 layer over everything, but usually produces kick ass NC. The last one i used ammonium nitrate and left it for about 2-3 hours.

[THErAPIST]

Use KNO3 but let it nitrate at about 10?c for 20-30 minutes

if memory serves:

40mL ~95% H2S04
35g KNO3

Stir in the KNO3 so that it dissolves and then let it sit for 30 minutes. Cram as much cotton ball in there as you can (slowly and over 10 minutes). The reactant vessle should be sitting in an ice/water bath with a wet cottony lump in it. Make sure the temp is around 10?C and then let it sit for about 20 minutes. Push the cotton around, fold it over, and mush it every couple minutes to keep hot spots out of it. As long as you stir it around frequently it wont get that KNO3 layer on it.

Filter it with ungodly amounts of water and then bicarb solution. If you don't let it dry fully before you light it on fire then it'll burn much more slowly.